Thoughts on adding a piano roll
I thought I’d start a new thread on the topic (if there’s not one already, sorry should of looked) . So it’s been hinted that it might be on the development list. It also has created some heated debate, notably over on the Audiobus forum with buns being thrown and toys not in the pram.
The resistance is essentially based on (if I’ve got this right)
There’s far more important areas for development and @giku is quick but there’s only one of him (unless there’s a secret clone giku module we don’t about).
It bloats. Drambo has a wonderfully concise vision and by constantly adding extra features to core workflow (especially around sequencing) that quality is undermined.
The counter argument is that, well implemented, it would benefit a lot of users who really do want this and Drambo would be all the more powerful for it. It wouldn’t have to be ‘front of shop’ so there’s always the possibility of just not going in there.
Comments
Doh I was probably a bit late there 🤣
Seems to me that all depends on how it’s implemented.
We don’t know exactly what @giku has in mind. Adding a kind of ‘over sequencer’ modularity to the existing sequencer doesn’t, I don’t think, spoil the integrity of anything. There’s potentially a kind of symmetry between that and the track modules. That could be quite exciting.
I was softly in the no camp but Drambo should be a workhorse and that entails flexibility. I guess I’m p-roll neutral, I think it can be pulled of without seeming intrusive or even there at all if it’s not wanted. That’s important.
@SpartanClownTide I agree.
It's not at all about destroying anything in the current UI and workflow, and I like @giku's idea of a separate view that is more inviting to people that love the modular synthesis features exactly as they are in Drambo but just can't get friends with the sequencer as it is now.
It's not even a discussion about better or worse, it's all about different Drambo users with different preferences, and adding more flexibility in this regard might make Drambo the #1 sequencer for use inside AUM, because as we know, there's still not much out there that delivers.
If Drambo had a piano roll editor, I would prefer it over the current editor.
I think it would make Drambo overall more intuitive as a song writing platform. For me, the current sequencer is functional as a live recorder, it has the resolution to capture small timing variance. But I prefer to edit my hand played mistakes visually, and I think that's where the piano roll format excels.
BUT.... For me personally. My primary use for Drambo is sound and synth design, and I'm patiently waiting for new modules for sound creation, Instrument construction, and signal controlling/routing/switching.
Before a piano roll editor.... I'd rather have a "voice layers" module that can output poly voices down-stream, filters that will help me better emulate the sound of an OB-X and other vintage synths, a compact version of the ADSR module w/modulatable knobs, and the AUv3 container module that would turn stand-alone Drambo into a sound design modular power-house.
Do we (general we) really need to worry that Drambo can be ruined by the addition of a piano roll editor? Maybe just make the piano roll editor an in-App-purchase. Then those who want it can buy it. I'd gladly pay to add aspects of functionality to Drambo that are on my wish list.....
In-App-purchases could be categorized as features, and groups of modules, tailored to meet the creation needs of for specific purposes of use.
I'll buy the expansion packs that optimize Drambo for my uses. Others can buy the packs that serve their own needs. If someone doesn't like piano roll editors, then they don't have to buy the piano roll editor expansion pack.
That's one way I could see this working out.
Just my honest opinion.
Hey everyone, I’m new to the forum and to Drambo. I bought it mainly with the intention of using it as a sampler. Programming drums, chopping samples and the like. However, after using it for a few days, I realize the synthesis and multi-sample capabilities actually make it a really capable of handling melodies/chord content!
I quite like the sequencer for drums and simple bass lines. P-lock is awesome! However, for more complex tonal content I’ve been relying on recording from my midi keyboard, and crossing my fingers that I don’t mess it up because there’s no real way to edit the sequence.
I guess I could host Drambo in a DAW or AUM and use a different sequencer to get what I’m after. However, this seems to go against the vibe I’m getting from Drambo which is that it’s not a DAW but that you should have all the tools you need right inside to make your songs. I’m also not too keen on the AUM workflow as it seems to be closer to the VST hell I’m trying to get away from.
I’m happy with the app as it is and feel I got plenty of value for my money. However, if the developer is planning on expanding the app, I feel having a piano roll or other means of editing sequences at a granular level would be a welcome addition.
I’d imagine the UI to a bit similar to the step view but allow to see all the notes in a sequence for a single track.
As I don't want to change/complicate existing workflow this shouldn't bother anyone. Extended editors will be available in EDIT mode: velocity bars, step components.. etc.. Initially I didn't want to do this, but a logical and natural consequence is having extended MIDI note editor among them ( called piano-roll :)
It won't be here very soon, I want to improve existing sequencer functionality first (higlighted keys, note stacking etc..)
I am not pro or against it but can imagine it might convert many p-roll fans to Drambo.
Personally I'm not a static music maker and wouldn't dream of diving into note editing while jamming and would rather rerecord a section rather that fuck with notes but I know many people like that level of precision and currently it takes quite a bit of brain juice to edit individual notes, esp when it comes to chords. Note stacking should take care of that though.
In fact, why don't you just use term piano roll instead of note stacking ;)
(bad joke)
I think a decent piano roll as an IAP would be good some day. To me piano rolls are funny, simple things, but vary from app to app in awkwardness. I think I maybe just don’t like them by design, but they do display notes in a format that makes sense/logical for editing.
Not missing a Piano roll for my workflow in Drambo...but then again, I love programming on my OctaTrack...so the current workflow feels totally natural to me. The only thing I want is for the STEPS to show which notes are selected when I press it. :)
Good to hear an extended midi note editor is planned :) This will keep me "in" Drambo a lot longer as currently I prefer using other sequencers and record in to Drambo. If it can compete with the depth of Modstep sequencer + clips in AU format it will be a very deep environment.
Looks like Imaginando just updated LK to support AUv3. It has a pretty nice feature set and offers an Ableton style Clip Launcher. Was thinking about connecting it with Drambo to see how that workflow feels.
The current sequencer is somewhat useful for sound design... but I don't find it useful for actual compositions.
So a piano roll would interest me cause I like to play stuff longer than a single pattern. I'm also fine just using Drambo as a synth and ignoring the sequencer.
Never thought I'd say this but I've recently been exploring ZenBeats and it's a pretty nice AUv3 host with both a time-line and clip-launching with just enough features to avoid triggering my annoyance nerve too much :)
I’ve tried to get along with Zenbeats but something always feels off me me. I never feel inspired to make a track in it.
I know it’s a purely aesthetic thing, but i find apps like Modstep, ElectribeWave and Drambo to feel more in tune with the way i think while composing.
Drambo has hit every nerve and neuron in my brain. I always get a Dopamine rush when composing in Drambo...and pattern chaining is a great way to extend a sequence when you need to do longer things. I guess i love working through limits and constraints and see them as an opportunity to push one self.
Really excited to see where The Drambo Genius takes us over the next year. 🙏🏼💕
Thank you sir. You also keep doing what you’re doing. Love your work and what you’ve been sharing with us. Keep it up👊🏼™️
This would be so very welcome.
It will be the next turn.
For you, I will piece a noodle together!
May i put in a request for some noodles. Lightly fried in some Sesame Oil and topped with Kimchi and tofu.
If I wanted a piano roll I'd be using a DAW. Couldn't you just use a piano roll like Atom in AUM to drive Drambo if you wanted that?
I'm not opposed if that's what the people want but just give me multi out first
I'm using NS2 for composition at the moment and it's no fun transferring all the MIDI tracks into Drambo, let alone having to add the p-locks later and not being able to do all in one box in a straightforward way.
I could argue "why don't you just load 16 instances of Drambo" but please let's just agree that different people have different workflows and different preferences.
Yes!
Yes, I've only seen it marketed as a groovebox. I've had a bunch of hardware and iOS groovebox and with the exception of Ampify Groovebox none of them have ever had a piano roll
I would use Drambo so much more if it had a piano roll. Something easy to edit notes, remove, add, move around, quantized or un-quantized, edit velocities and so on.
Right now I must stick to NanoStudio 2 and Gadget for harmony stuff. Editing and composing with Drambo is super annoying, it's more a rhythmical and noise/textural tool for me at least. But it has so much potential for more. I would absolutely love to integrate the p-locking features to my chord progressions, bass lines and melodies.